Date: Sun, 4 Aug 1996 20:31:49 -0400 (EDT) From: HUMPHREYS@uthscsa.edu Date: Mon, 15 Jul 1996 21:27:54 -0500 (CDT) Subject: p/g! and arena thoughts Howdy! I've never tried to get on #p/g! myself but if the people on there would kick off our dear Ruth after calling her a bitch then they can kiss my big white ass! What chumps! (please hold, debunchifying in progress....) --------------------------------------------------------- From: Steven Horwitz Date: Wed, 17 Jul 1996 09:33:06 EDT Subject: stuff and more stuff After reading John Santore's (you remember him? The appropriately named "Grand High Asshole of #p/g!"...) post, he makes the best case possible for leaving that IRC to itself. Ruth, you're too good for them! [ Well, at least you try to be tactful about it. I think if you knew John you'd see he put that in just to get a reaction out of people like yourself. Can't say I blame him, his experiment works. :rush-mgr ] --------------------------------------------------------- From: Darren J Kozlek Date: Wed, 17 Jul 1996 08:51:31 -0500 (CDT) Subject: In defense of Ruth... I understand most of the Rush threads on IRC (ie #p/g) are "tired" or "used up" so if you want to discuss personal stuff fine. The fact that you treat new people or people you dislike from NMS poorly is also your right. I thought most people on NMS were past that kind of crap but if you like to remind yourselves of high school years gone past and the "cool" juvenile actions that went with it be MY GUEST. Just keep it off the NMS. [ Actually Darren, he can post all he wants. You may like not like him and in fact many of you don't. I frankly find John and the rest of those guys on #p/g! have a rather weird if not sick sense of humor that may not appeal to the masses. In fact, they will openly admit this. It's like I said, #p/g! is an "Acquired Taste (tm)" Beginners need not apply, and while I'm sure John can speak for himself, I hate it when other people on here try to tell people that they can't post or they ought to go elsewhere. :rush-mgr (yes, can be seen once in a blue moon lurking on #p/g!) ] Ruth - keep up the posts - the vast majority of us find them amusing. Flames/replies/ and all else welcome by email. --------------------------------------------------------- From: Colin Wright Date: Wed, 17 Jul 1996 10:06:39 -0400 Subject: This, that, and the other inter-thingy Hey Rush-buds, NOT my first post ... Have NOT been lurking for a while ... Just a few brain-dumps ... [Non relevant shit deleted] ----- Re: #p/g IRC channel ------------ As John Santore put as his sign-off at the bottom of his post in NMS #1378: John Santore Slythex on IRC Grand High Asshole of #p/g! I think the third line says it all. [ Sorry, you fell for the trap. I'm sure John wrote that on PURPOSE. I would probably bet money on it. :rush-mgr ] See the rest of ya's in #yyz or #2112. --------------------------------------------------------- From: BINETWORK!B5PO2!strode@biattgw.attmail.com (Strode, Cory) Date: Wed, 17 Jul 1996 09:23:00 +0000 Subject: IRC and other stuff > -John Santore > Slythex on IRC > Grand High Asshole of #p/g! >[ John, I don't mind you defending the channel, but it's uncool to attack >Ruth on the digest on a personal level don't you agree? I would prefer to >keep the flames off the NMS and restrict it to email or even #p/g! :rush-mgr ] THIS is why I like this forum. A polite reminder to be polite. After reading the info from people here who have been on #p/g and John's response, I think we all can see that this NOT something we want to contribute to. I run a RTC Thursday and Sunday nights on the rapidly fading GEnie system, and it take little or no effort to say "Hi" to new people as they show up. I also find it a bit odd that a RUSH chat would be so blatantly hostile when every RUSH fan I've met in the real world of light and shadow has been polite, intelligent and very willing to talk about RUSH. Oh well.... --------------------------------------------------------- From: Stacey Glaesmann Date: Wed, 17 Jul 96 12:47:06 -0500 Subject: John Santore [ Stacey, why don't you do me a big favor and send John email privately. Thank you. :rush-mgr ] Later Stacey G. --------------------------------------------------------- From: Susan Fleming Date: Wed, 17 Jul 1996 11:28:35 -0700 Subject: Re: IRC civil war and Worldwide Pants Good Day Music Lovers! This is only my second post here. I usually just sit back, read, and take it all in with an occasional personal e-mail response, however I can't help but respond publicly on this whole IRC thing.... Are we waging some sort of "inter-thingie" civil war here or what?? I've been on IRC several times lately. I've tried p/g, and yes, was ignored (by the way..I read the homepage first and made sure I had a non-Rush related nick before entering) IMHO, they have no "obligation" to aknowledge everyone who enters and have the right to name the channel whatever they wish. Yes, I was dissapointed in the lack of "friendliness" toward me but maybe that channel just isn't for me! ("I can't pretend a stranger is a long-awaited friend"...sound familliar?) I can't honestly form an educated opinon about the channel because I haven't spent enough time on it to do so. I've also tried #yyz. Very differnt channel. Very friendly, and, contrary to popular opinon, they DON'T constantly talk about Rush, but if the subject is brought up, it is gladly discussed and the regulars are very-well informed on Rush issues. Hell...there was a "virtual food fight" on there one evening...(just to let out pent-up aggression while awaiting the release of TFE!) I do enjoy this channel and frequent it (when Netcom is behaving...) I've also met some really great people in there. Now I didn't want this to sound like all the other p/g vs. yyz posts of late. Everyone does have valid points. I guess what I'm ultimately tring to say is...If you haven't been to either room don't form an opinion based soley on these posts (including mine) Try both channels and form your own opinon! And if you don't like one or the other...don't "bash" it on TNMS. If you must "bash" I, nor anyone else can stop you...I guess that's what pg-down is for. Flame if you must, publicly or privately. Better yet: /msg me on IRC...you'll know where to find me! :} --------------------------------------------------------- From: jokker@erie.net (Jim Wagner) Date: Wed, 17 Jul 1996 15:00:08 -0400 Subject: If John Santore wants the right to give an opinion.... [ Jim, why don't you do me a BIG FAVOR and send John some email okay? I'm not particular fond of you bashing someone you know ABSOLUTELY NOTHING about. Take it to email. :rush-mgr ] --------------------------------------------------------- From: "Ruth Goodman" Date: 17 Jul 1996 12:19:11 -0700 Subject: Heh. People are Funny! Well, I got a lot of reaction to the p/g! issue, and it seems most are in agreement with me. I had a great laugh at John's attempted defense. It seems that while trying to defend the group of people are that hang on p/g!, he instead basically handed us all the information we need to tell us that these people are not fun to "chat" with. Ignoring the personal digs I do have to point out a couple of fallacies (spelled it right this time!) on his part. >Naw, we just kick people off when they 1) act moronic 2) come on >spewing rush crap we've already heard before as though it were the >greatest thing since sliced bread 3) for no reason other than we feel >like it. O.K. Paying close attention to reason #3... >And obviously you got repeatedly kicked for doing the same shit that got you kicked in the >first place. O.K. Seeing as how I usually only said "Hi", or nothing at all when I was kicked, you must be talking about reason #3 here right? My mere presence provokes you to "feel like" kicking me without first finding out if I might have something fun to discuss. That alone should tell the NMSrs here what we were talking about when we cmentioned that p/g! is NOT the place to meet nice Rush fans. [ Actually Ruth, please speak for yourself, you say #p/g! isn't the place for all the NMS'ers to meet nice fans. Sorry but I wasn't aware you were the NMS spokesperson. There are plenty of nice Rush fans on #p/g! I think you confuse NICE Rush fans with Rush fans who are DIFFERENT. :rush-mgr ] >Gee, if this #p/g! bashing post is considered serious business, I >don't even want to see what crap she posts when she isn't feeling so >somber. Well, too bad. You've missed some pretty damn funny crap then if I do say so myself. And based on my personal e-mail, I ain't the only one who thinks so. Listen Slythex, we've talked before on IRC several times, and for the most part you were pretty cool as long as we were not on p/g! There are also other p/g! regulars who I chat with on other channels who tell me that they also hate the people on p/g! who act the way that you so eloquently described. (I could name names, but then you might not let them play with you anymore). BTW, thanks for the detailed explanation. I couldn't have told people reasons NOT to join p/g! any better myself. You said it all. Always the loving Rush fan(atic) -Mom --------------------------------------------------------- From: EG26032@swt.edu Date: Wed, 17 Jul 1996 15:20:54 -0500 (CDT) Subject: I have a question I would imagine by now there have been 100 posts attacking the #p/g! guy and his personal flames (which were WAY out of line IMHO). I agree with Stacey Glaesmann and whatever her post said. --------------------------------------------------------- From: davidj@dsinet.dgtl.com (David Janssen) Date: 17 Jul 1996 13:46:29 GMT Subject: Re: 07/16/96 - The National Midnight Star #1377 In response to "jsbht@andrew.cmu.edu", and #p/g! replies, all I can say is [ David, I'll save you the embarassment right now and delete all your nonsense. Do me a BIG FAVOR and mail John himself okay? :rush-mgr ] [ More crap deleted. :rush-mgr ] If you are on NMS then get off!!! Rush Mgr, drop him like a rotten apple! Ruth deserves better than that! [ Uh..yeah sure! Whatever you say! Listen, take it to email. If anyone should be dropped from the list like a rotten apple, it is closed minded people who dictate that the NMS can't have certain type of fans. Sorry but I disagree with you 100%. And no, that doesn't mean that you or anyone will be kicked from the list. Not now, not ever. :rush-mgr ] --------------------------------------------------------- From: Uncle DAV Date: Wed, 17 Jul 96 19:01:05 EDT Subject: #p/g! Hi, I'm not one for flames and I'm NOT going to pop off here, but John Santore's post "defending" #p/g! (more like attacking outsiders of his clique) was totally uncalled for and downright immature. [ Oh I see. So one can come on here and attack him and the other people in #p/g! but of course he's not allowed to "defend" himself or the people of that channel? You may perceive it as uncalled for and immature but I'll say he has every right to post about and defend the channel if he wants. :rush-mgr ] I know you can probably give two hoots about my opinions, John, but please spare us the "my group is better than yours" talk. I have a funny feeling most of the NMS subscribers could care less. [ You know, perhaps we all need to reread's John's post. No where does he ever claim it was about "my group is better than yours". I'd say you were trying to put words in his mouth. :rush-mgr ] (and I think you're going to get a few flames back--Ruth is a popular lady around here) :> [ Yes, Ruth may be popular but that doesn't necessarily equate to her being right all the time about things. :rush-mgr ] Uncle D "Back off or these walls be gettin' dpalumbo@eden.rutgers.edu a free paint job!" --Willie Brown --------------------------------------------------------- From: Rush2112@aol.com Date: Wed, 17 Jul 1996 23:41:48 -0400 Subject: #p/g! >Well I don't much read the NMS anymore, but I do grep >it occasionally to see what people are saying bout us >these days. and i bet this guy, in his few glances at the NMS, since he doesn't really read it anymore, just happened to find all of those posts he quoted. a small percentage of the posts recently have been about #p/g!, and all the quotes he made were from a very short time period. meaning that he must have been pretty lucky to happen to look at those particular posts in those particular issues... [ Actually Bill, maybe someone told him there's talk about #p/g! on the list? Hmmm...maybe several people on the mailing list saw the posts about #p/g! and happen to be visitors of #p/g! Hmm..maybe one of them could be myself, a #p/g visitor in the past. Hmm.. Aaaaaaanyways, on to your post. :rush-mgr ] --------------------------------------------------------- From: Tgolic@aol.com Date: Wed, 17 Jul 1996 23:45:12 -0400 Subject: A few comments... [shit deleted] Drummer? Don't condemn JoeR for speaking his mind only because your opinions differ, rather because posts like his are purposely inflamatory. I know many are probably thinking I am guilty of the same for writing this but it needed to be pointed out. Why can't all posts be like Ruth's? I have yet to read a negative rant from her with the exception of the p/g* issue, which also needed to be pointed out. Thank you, TG --------------------------------------------------------- From: Cliff & Pam Wheaton Date: Thu, 18 Jul 1996 01:37:44 -0600 Subject: Stuff!! [shit deleted] IRC- I've been on #2112 & #yyz-fun there. I can't comment about #p/g!, tho-theres never anyone on when I go there. I hafta admit, I don't get on until rather late, late for most that is!! Usually after midnight for me!! Rush mgr-whats your nick? Maybe I've seen ya there? well, off to another place!! Keep rockin' Pam ( Rockin' on IRC!!! as if ya hadn't guessed!!) --------------------------------------------------------- From: "Kohler, Brian" Date: Thu, 18 Jul 96 09:12:00 EST Subject: irc and stuff Greetings Fellow Rush Buds! After reading some of the recent comments regarding #p/g! it sounds like it's kind of dumb. I've never been on, but why have a forum called GUP and purposely *not* discuss Rush? I guess it's their own private thing or something. Who has time to deal with all of that anyway? I guess they're having fun at whatever it is they do, so what the hell. [ Brian, I think you might have hit something there! About it being "their own private thing". If only everyone else could be like you Brian! :-) \ :rush-mgr ] --------------------------------------------------------- From: mrfranklin@ccgate.hac.com Date: Thu, 18 Jul 96 09:11:22 PST Subject: I agree with John Santore about #p/g! Hey All, Regarding the recent #p/g! discussions... I totally agree with everything John Santore said in his rebuttal on the attacks on #p/g! (nms1378 - #p/g! replies...) Well, okay, I don't agree with *everything* he said, but overall I agree. Well, not quite *overall* agree, more like I agreed with a few things. Come to think of it I only agreed with one thing - his sig... > -John Santore > Slythex on IRC > Grand High Asshole of #p/g! Mark Franklin Nothing on IRC Basically Nice Decent Guy on TNMS [ Mark, well, I agree completely with what you say! Well, actually, not everything. Hmm..come to think of it, just a few things. In fact, probably nothing at all. I disagree with your sig though. Hmmm.. Basically a nice decent guy? Oh..okay sure.. With love, Basically the nice and decent High Asshole of the NMS. :rush-mgr ] Practice random acts of kindess and senseless acts of beauty - bumper sticker --------------------------------------------------------- From: "Ruth Goodman" Date: 18 Jul 1996 13:01:40 -0700 Subject: Roy Dude! [shit deleted] Words of wisdom (to those who don't already know this) and especially in response to those on p/g!... ONLY ASS-HOLES WOULD THINK THAT BEING AN ASS-HOLE IS FUNNY! [ So what are you saying Ruth? That I'm an asshole as well as John? Please do reply. That would be asshole@yyz.com for you. Wait, better make that nms_grand_asshole@yyz.com Personally, your definition of funny may not be anywhere REMOTELY close to mine, or John, or others on #p/g! And if your definition of asshole requires you to use your definition of funny, then I might say, people whose sense of humor are not like mine or John's might be considered ASSHOLES THEMSELVES. Wouldn't you agree? With love and more importantly humor, the original ~Rush Fanatic~ :rush-mgr ] Always the loving Rush fan(atic) -Ruth The River!!!! --------------------------------------------------------- From: Steven Horwitz Date: Thu, 18 Jul 1996 22:1519 EDT Subject: yadda yadda yadda More loose threads.... Of course the Grand High Asshole uses that name to bait people. Either it's that or he's just stupid (well...). I'm more than happy to rise to the bait when the sphincter fits. Why does the phrase "be cool or be cast out" keep popping into my head? [ I'd say you should think first before deciding if the sphincter fits or not, based on someone's self-proclamation. The Grand Asshole of the NMS. Yes, that would be myself. Does the sphincter fit in this case? Careful, it's a trick question. :rush-mgr ] --------------------------------------------------------- From: Tony Dormio Date: Fri, 19 Jul 96 10:16 EST Subject: #p/g! I would just like to say that I just had a perfectly pleasant time on #p/g! this morning. I'd never been to that channel before but, no one was rude,and we basically had a good time. Just thought I'd mention that hear since the channel has been getting a bad rap lately. BTW: We never talked about Rush...afterall, who really cares about that fat ass anyway? --------------------------------------------------------- From: leors@ele.puc-rio.br (Leonardo Rocha Souza) Date: Fri, 19 Jul 96 10:50:50 EST Subject: #p/g channel Hi NMSers ! Can anyone tell me how to connect with the #p/g channel (I don't know very much of IRC) so I can exercise my VERY VERY SICK sense of humour ? Trust me, I need this. sick mind Leonardo. [ Send John some email I'm sure he'll tell you all about it. :rush-mgr ] --------------------------------------------------------- From: Niki Leboeuf Date: Fri, 19 Jul 1996 17:13:00 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Reminiscing about #p/g! Hi, John Santore. I remember when you didn't come across as such an... well, let's leave the personal attacks out of it. I remember when #p/g! was open to anyone who wanted to jump in. People would say on the digest, "Hey, let's meet on #p/g! at X o'clock Central Standard Time" or whatever--or, more usually, just, "Hey, come chat on #p/g! sometime!" and folks would show up and chat about anything. I remember when #p/g! really WAS the official IRC channel, and Rush-related topics wouldn't get you kicked off, because everyone has a different take on anything, so no topic was really a dead horse (unless in the case of one person saying the same thing for the umpteenth time, of course). I visited there for a long time back in 1994 when I was on my college search and staying in the dorm room of someone who happened to have a Mac hooked up. It was my first introduction to IRC. I stayed on #p/g! for about four hours. The people there, then, were flexible enough to allow several conversations to go on at once, some of them public, and some /msg'd. It was kind of like mental gymnastics. Some people talked about Rush stuff. Some didn't. One person came on all drunk and depressed, talking about his girlfriend. No one kicked him off for it, or insulted him, or treated him like anything less than another human being. Someone else started up a conversation with me with the usual "So what's you're favorite Rush song?" and of course that branched off into several tangents which don't come to mind now. We didn't get kicked off for it. Instead, other folks jumped into the conversation and everything was very friendly. I got a kick out of telling the Rush-bot to spew song lyrics. I wasn't the only one. We had lyric-spewing wars, but forgot to keep score. Nobody got kicked off for that either. If someone had a problem with someone else, they either kept it to themselves, or were mature enough to say so to that person's face. The last time I visited, maybe last year, I didn't get kicked off either. Several personalities there were pretty nasty to each other, but none of them kicked me off or called me a bitch. I had nothing to add to the conversation at hand, so I left the channel. John, you're telling us that now it's common practice on that channel to call people names just for joining the channel, and to kick people off just because you feel like it. And repeatedly kick them off when they try to join again. You're telling us that Rush topics are taboo, that only certain topics are allowed by your clique, and any deviation will get you kicked off and treated like an idiot. Your recent post was definitely a good reason for most of us to stay away. Those who like being assholes to other people, of course, will think it's great. Now, of course, you're going to rip this post apart and sprinkle it with personal insults like you did to Ruth, right? From reading what you said to her, I don't except you to actually respond in a mature or considerate fashion. I dare you to prove me wrong. It doesn't matter whether your post was just a "troll" kind of thing, to "see whether people would react" as the Rush-mgr said, defending you. I'm willing to bet it was a preview of the kind of treatment one should expect if one joins #p/g! now, and I'm very sorry for it. I mourn greatly the #p/g! that I remember, where everyone treated everyone else with the simple respect due to a fellow human being, and no one got kicked off for daring to say "Hi, how are you doing, what's you're favorite Rush album?" Meanwhile: so, Ruth and everyone else, when are people generally on the other channels? Which one of them is more often in existence? I'll see you there sometime, if I actually get some IRC time on my hands... --A Usually Friendly Vortex ---------------------------------------------------------- From: Kern.3@osu.edu (Leesa J. Kern) Date: Sat, 20 Jul 1996 12:20:54 -0400 (EDT) Subject: IRC Wars Wow John!! An actual well-thought out, rational reply, with a minimum of swearwords!! I'm impressed :) :) (just kidding' hon...how ya been!) As yet another #p/g! veteran, I'll do John's favorite thing and just say "Ditto" to everything he said...that should get me banned for a few weeks, but I won't care because, as John says, and I think as we ALL say, it's just IRC.... [ Yes, banned for a few weeks, or even kicked off the NMS. :rush-mgr ] To rush-mgr: Yeah, attacking Ruth personally would have been tacky if she hadn't already attacked everyone on #p/g! publicly and personally. Perhaps you should have added a little tag line to her post about that as well. Leesa, wondering if Neil's "get a life" line wasn't as pompous and arrogant as it originally sounded. madrigal on #p/g! --------------------------------------------------------- From: dennisfp@innet.com (Dennis F. Pupello II) Date: Fri, 19 Jul 1996 05:12:02 GMT Subject: #p/g! & John Santore Steven Horwitz wrote: >After reading John Santore's (you remember him? The appropriately >named "Grand High Asshole of #p/g!"...) post, he makes the best case >possible for leaving that IRC to itself. Ruth, you're too good for >them! >[ Well, at least you try to be tactful about it. I think if you knew John >you'd see he put that in just to get a reaction out of people like >yourself. Can't say I blame him, his experiment works. :rush-mgr ] I have to chime in here and add my voice to those who say that #p/g! is a rather cold and unwelcoming environment. My few times stopping in over the past couple years have been reminiscent of Ruth's experience: either ignored or met with passive hostility. Then again, if the regulars of #p/g! (of which there aren't many ;) want to act that way, fine. I mean, it's their loss :) My suggestion for all those new to irc would be to try #yyz, #2112 or start your own new Rush channel. :) I myself hang in #deathmatch and #quake, for two main reasons: they are big active channels and I'm a Doom2/Quake addict :) Hope to see some of you from NMS on irc, or come visit #quake or #deathmatch to say hello. Word of warning, these channels are friendly enough, but almost nothing is sacred, including sex, religion & violence. If you can handle that, come by! ;) Cya :} Oh, if my sig happens to wig out, I go by _Yyz_ on irc. Internet mail: dennisfp@innet.com Irc #quake #deathmatch #quakematch: _Yyz_ WWW: http://www.widomaker.com/~bhess/yearbook/page17.html --------------------------------------------------------- From: EtanG4raps@aol.com Date: Mon, 22 Jul 1996 03:24:24 -0400 Subject: traffic on the 10 [shit deleted] 2nd that punk from #p/g should be shot - i will not waste time saying how rude he is but i will say i love the NMS and the family feeling we have for a common interest that we love - it is cool here !! [ I was going to just axe this above posting/portion, but seeing as how of you are SOOOO interested in making sure I do my job, I'll leave it in. BTW Etan, maybe you should send email to that "punk that should be shot" next time before putting crap like this in the digest. :rush-mgr ] --------------------------------------------------------- From: J.Screaton@sheffield.ac.uk (James Screaton) Date: Mon, 22 Jul 96 09:04:47 BST Subject: #p/g & TFE Hi, Quick #p/g opinion. I didn't like the tone, but I remember John's name from a while back. Ruth is a relative newcomer, and doesn't speak for everyone (nothing personal, Ruth). Personally, each to their own. --------------------------------------------------------- From: Christopher_Muller.WESTINGHOUSE-PGBU@notes.compuserve.com Date: 22 Jul 96 11:16:58 EDT Subject: Critical Mass has arrived [shit deleted] As for this whole #p/g! vs. the people slamming thing (who really did the slamming? Or who was allowed to slam?), I won't comment on the channel; but I will comment, as a subscriber of this list, about how the discussion appeared to me. It all just looked pretty shitty and one sided. I know that the Rush-mgr wanted to allow the guy to defend #p/g!, and that's fine. But do we allow personal flames on this list or not??? [ Short answer no. But sometimes it occurs. But in fairness to John, since Ruth took the first stab, I allowed John that same courtesy. :rush-mgr ] --------------------------------------------------------- From: mrf@sdiusa.com (Mazen Fadel) Date: Mon, 22 Jul 1996 08:48:26 -0700 Subject: IRC Is it just me or the RUSH manager is rather biased about this whole IRC issue? With all due respect I don't think Ruth was ever trying to come accross as the spokesperson for the NMS. She was just expressing her opinion. In addition, your prevented 2 posts that were seemingly on Ruth's side to be posted (asking them to take it to private email). [ Okay fine. Are you really interested in hearing "John, you said it best yourself you're an asshole." Or are you really interested in "John get a haircut your julvenile?" Or are you interested in "John, you're a neanderthal", or are you interested in "Hey rush-mgr dude, kick that loser off the list." blah blah blah. Next time, I'll simply delete the post as I have done. I left them in because I wanted to comment on something and the stuff I took out was just that! Take that personal attack stuff to email. And as far as Ruth not being a spokesperson, hey, it was her that said "#p/g! is NOT the place to meet nice Rush fans, just wanted to tell the NMS's here that." Whatever. :rush-mgr ] Unless these posts were incredibly rude, maybe you should have been consistent and not expressed your own personal opinion while you prevented others from doing so. [ Expressing my opinion is what I do, but I think you can at least be civil about it and not resort to the name calling. :rush-mgr ] Ruth wrote: That alone should tell the NMSrs here what we >were talking about when we cmentioned that p/g! is NOT the place to meet nice >Rush fans. > > [ Actually Ruth, please speak for yourself, you say #p/g! isn't the place f\ or > all the NMS'ers to meet nice fans. Sorry but I wasn't aware you were the > NMS spokesperson. There are plenty of nice Rush fans on #p/g! I think > you confuse NICE Rush fans with Rush fans who are DIFFERENT. :rush-mgr\ ] Mazen Fadel Systematic Designs International, Inc. ////Systems for Factory Automation//// --------------------------------------------------------- From: Mike Horwitz Date: Mon, 22 Jul 1996 12:32:51 -0400 (EDT) Subject: the IRC stuff and other tidbits Hi, Maybe we need two seperate issues again. One for normal NMS stuff, and one for this IRC stuff. At least that kind of stuff keeps the :rush mgr busy. ;-) --------------------------------------------------------- From: Jeremy Brown Date: Mon, 22 Jul 1996 13:28:21 -0500 (EST) Subject: IRC Question ? I don't want to sound like an idiot asking but I'll ask anyway. On what server is #p/g and #yyz anyway? Jeremy --------------------------------------------------------- From: CX1@aol.com Date: Mon, 22 Jul 1996 14:51:30 -0400 Subject: Come back, NMSers! Everyone sit down and shut up! :) With all this #p/g! crap going on, we need to come back down to earth and remember what this list is about...and fast! Contemplate the following: Idiots who profess who *should* and *shouldn't* be on this list should just go bobbing for turds! (Probably their only skill). Jimmy and Meg work their asses off to bring us this list...if you feel you could do a better job, then f**king VOLUNTEER! Better yet...SEND THEM MONEY! Until you're willing to create your own Rush list and dictate the terms of subscription therein, then sit your ass down and enjoy the NMS and save the bitching and moaning for CX1! And don't accuse CX1 of playing cow-tow to the rush-mgrs...It's an insult to me and all *intelligent* NMSers to question the manner in which the rush-mgrs offer us this great *FREE* inter-thingy! I don't agree with everything they say or do, either. Tough shit on me! And tough shit on you, too! [ And I can appreciate that people don't agree with what I do or say all the time. I have had several meaningful conversations through email with those who may not agree with me. Just keep in mind this list is *MODERATED*, it does have *RULES*, it isn't a "free for all", if you want that, go to USENET. Rules are simple, please keep the bootleg talk out of here, no one wants to hear "will trade for this, do you have this show? Auctioning off my collection! Highest Bid please! For sale cheap! etc..etc.." and finally I ask people not call others names. Flames, slander, libel, name calling, what have you, please leave that stuff to email. So if I take out a post or comment out a post for a reason, it's usually because of the RULES, not that I'm playing Mr. Censor (oh the dreaded C word). Who really on here wants to hear "John, you're an asshole, you said it yourself." "Fuck off John, list manager, take him off the list", blah blah blah. Frankly, I could do without it and the majority of the list, I think can too. :rush-mgr ] This list is a collection of Rush fans...as diverse and wacky a group of people as I've ever seen. Part of the beauty of it all is that we have very different ideas and opinions. We've got: A) People who are funny (Ruth) B) People who have two brains (Prof) C) People who can't face CX1 (Vortex) ;) D) People who are careful (Ladder 214 GT) E) People who are insane (Pam--rockin' cabbie) F) People with big mouths (CX1 and Nick Evans) G) People who I bet are really beautiful in person (Nicole) H) People who can play the F*CK out of a guitar (Zach from Power Windows) I) And People who are the embodiment of the carefree, total Rush fan (Brian (you the man!) Kohler) If I left anyone out, remember that we're all in this together...without even *one* of us, this list just wouldn't be the same. So "NMSer A" can't stand "NMSer B"...so what? Maybe you just had a flame war with another subscriber. Maybe you just met another subscriber and had a great time. Maybe you got pissed when Jimmy deleted hard-earned information from your last post. Doesn't matter! These experiences are engraved in our memories...good or bad/for better or for worse...and will be remembered as a great time in our lives. [ Just to clarify something, when a post usually gets deleted, I always try to make it a point to write the person and tell him/her why. Of course we don't ALWAYS come to an agreement but if I delete something for some reason and you don't agree, by all means, if I haven't contacted you first, then send me email, and I'll explain myself. :rush-mgr ] So...to sum up what my dad once said: THERE IS NO POT OF GOLD AT THE END OF THE RAINBOW! THE TIME IS NOW. THIS *IS* THE POT OF GOLD! ENJOY IT WHILE YOU STILL CAN! CX1 - Holier (and getting better with age) than thou "All those precious, wasted years...who will pay?" --------------------------------------------------------- From: eg26032@swt.edu (Eric Gumtow) Date: Mon, 22 Jul 1996 15:21:52 -0500 (CDT) Subject: I'm disappointed >From: Stacey Glaesmann > > [ Stacey, why don't you do me a big favor and send John email privately. > Thank you. :rush-mgr ] >From: EG26032@swt.edu > >I would imagine by now there have been 100 posts attacking the #p/g! >guy and his personal flames (which were WAY out of line IMHO). I >agree with Stacey Glaesmann and whatever her post said. Since my last post relied upon Stacey's post (which was somehow mysteriously omitted), I'll explain what Stacey said so no one is confused. Here is what she said: the truth. Rush-mgr, you cannot allow one flame in, but not another. [ Because, Ruth was allowed one post (maybe I shouldn't have put it in at all) and so John should be allowed to say something back. Any *SUBSEQUENT* posts will be set to inspection for character flames. Even in John's reply, I made sure I specifically told him if he plans on attacking Ruth at a personal level, he ought to email her, and that's what he's been doing. :rush-mgr ] If you deleted Stacey's post, then you should have deleted John's post. The volatility of the two was equal. Perhaps rush-mgr is trying to gain some popularity in #p/g!? [ Yes, by God! I think you've stumbled upon it. If only you knew, I would daresay I was one of the first ones to ever hang out on #p/g! YEARS ago. It's not about popularity on the channel, I'm defending it and its users who are FAR from ASSHOLES, if people would just recognize them for who they are. :rush-mgr ] --------------------------------------------------------- From: Scott Finkel Date: Tue, 23 Jul 1996 08:38:35 -0700 Subject: Under the spell of the mighty flame troll Greeting All Planets of the Solar Federation! I just want to know one thing, rush manager--why all the defense of John? Personal friend? I realize that he came on TNMS to goad people, (probably) to further his image (and that of the #p/g! channel) the way he wanted to, and to stir things up in general. Yes, many of the responses to Salvatore's inflamatory post may have ignorant qualities to them, (i.e. people are falling under the flame troll's mighty spell) but the censorship on your part, IMO, is uncalled for. [ Oh no! CENSORSHIP! Okay, tell you what, every post I get from now on that has name calling, character assasinations, or plain offensive attacks on John, or whoever it may be on the NMS, I'll make a digest just for you and you can do what you want with it. :rush-mgr ] Let people be ignorant. It shows in their posts. Usually you are really good on this issue. This is the first time in my year+ of subscribing that I've actually seen you censor people on TNMS. (well, I guess since you do all the work you can choose to do what you want, but...) What happened to the freedom of email? [ Nothing, it's still there, just keep the rules of the list in mind and we'll try and get along. I think I'm smart enough to know the difference between "John, you neanderthal, get off the list, you asshole you said it best yourself you julvenile with a haircut, blah blah blah " and something a bit more meaningful like "Well, I don't like #p/g! for the following reason." Which BTW is better than "#p/g! what a bunch of assholes" :rush-mgr ] unflamingly still a fan of the :rush-mgr ] team, :the wacky breadman ] "half-baked ideas are better than no ideas at all" - Scott J. Finkel, Illustrator Raytheon Range Systems Engineering Kwajalein, RMI - Not one shred of evidence supports the notion that life is serious. --------------------------------------------------------- From: joem@metrolink.net (joem) Date: Mon, 22 Jul 1996 18:13:27 -0400 Subject: I find it very ironic........ Buenos Nochas, Mein Froinds! I would like to say a few things about the IRC issue, even though I don't use them anymore. I do frequent 2 Chat rooms on the Internet, and have met a great number of very cool Rush Fans so I see no need to use IRC. Also the ones I have met on Chat are ALWAYS more than friendly and willing to talk about Rush and related things. The picture I post of me has me in my Counterparts tour shirt, and I get MANY posts like "nice shirt" or "Rush Rules" and the conversation goes from there. I have even met many that post to TNMS, which is always cool :) I have nothing against IRC channels, and Mr. Santore's comments prove my feelings about alot of people that use them. I would like to know from the Rush-Mgr. why it is Ok for Mr. Santore to post something half a digest long (which should have been taken to email), then defend his right to post whatever he wants. Then when others post something that they "have a right to post" in the digest THEY are told to take it to email. I find that extremely unfair to them, and VERY ironic. I'm not here to *bash* a soul, I just don't think it's fair to defend someone for having the right to post something that should have been emailed privately in the first place, then delete other posts from people and say to them it's NOT ok to post their feelings, and they HAVE to take it to email. That's not right at all. If I don't want to read it I know where the page down is...... It makes me laugh to think that Mr. Santore needs to use all that space to defend an IRC that he says doesn't need to defend itself in the first place. Maybe people like him are why Neil is so bent out of shape........dunno :) A Farewell to Things, Joe *wondering why* Morisseau [ It might be unfair to them, but they should know better to post (those whose posts I have deleted and/or taken out portions - you know who you are) things along the lines of name-calling and such. :rush-mgr ] --------------------------------------------------------- From: John Santore Date: Mon, 22 Jul 1996 18:27:48 -0400 (EDT) Subject: My email address For those people who want to flame me, my address is jsbh@andrew.cmu.edu. (Yeah, I know it's in the header and sig file too, but I need to post for it to show up) There's no need pester the Rush-mgr or the NMS further. #p/g! was flamed once publically, I replied once publically, and now take it to mail if you feel further need to comment. Thanks for your support :-) All my love, John the asshole :-) [ You mean GRAND HIGH ASSHOLE John, not just plain asshole. :rush-mgr ] --------------------------------------------------------- From: Niki Leboeuf Date: Mon, 22 Jul 1996 15:34:56 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Red Barchetta! / The #p/g! debate, or, an OPEN letter to the Rush-mgr 1) RED BARCHETTA HITS THE INDIE 500 Susan posted her WONDERFUL top ten list of Why The Red Barchetta Won The Race...and besides ROFL, all I have to say is... > 4. Geddy had Red Barchetta blasting on the stereo. Isn't that kinda circular...? :) 2) AN OPEN LETTER TO THE RUSH-MGR First off: Ruth, you can be my spokesperson anytime on this matter. Matter o' fact, I'm pretty certain I would have agreed with all the stuff that got clipped out of the final version of the NMS #1381. Rush-mgr, I understand you find it hard to keep silent while the group trashes one of your best friends. But I've never seen your "censoring notes" get quite this nasty. I mean, usually it's just a "Sorry, take this to e-mail" and that's it. But now it's more like, "do me a favor and take this crap to e-mail!" That strikes me as unfair. The only person who read what you clipped is you. No one else gets to see it and judge for themselves whether it realy is "crap" like you say it is. [ There's a fair amount trust that goes into the moderation of a list. For the most part, I think I do okay. Obviously it would be foolish of me or ANYONE to think they can satisfy 100% of the customers 100% of the time. Now I've known this fact since 1989 and it will never change. If you don't trust my judgement, or don't like what I do, or this list, I can offer you no solution but to unsubscribe yourself. I would bargain crap to me would most likely be crap to you too. That is unless you like flames. :rush-mgr ] I just think it's somewhat unjust to clip out someone's message and then tell the whole NMS readership that "I think what this person sent was crap and I'm going to humiliate them publically for it!" when no one else even gets to see the alleged crap and maybe, quite possible, decide that maybe it wasn't crap after all. [ On that matter, it really is a catch-22 isn't it. Should the post be deleted for some reason then of course I must answer to "Oh NO! My POST! how could you! You big nasty CENSOR! You didn't include my post!" Too bad they didn't read the rules, if you're going to call someone names and be derogatory about it, then email would be the forum. :rush-mgr ] Also, in other debates, people have accused each other of acting immature and stepping way out of line before. Since when does such an accusation merit your stepping in with a "Well maybe YOU think so..."? This is why I'm pretty sure Slythex is a personal friend of yours--you're taking sides so overtly here and using your moderator-abilities unfairly against people who don't take your side. I mean, here's what I saw--perhaps others can back me up: John Santore posted a long article purportedly to defend the frequenters of #p/g! against accusations that they were acting like assholes. But his post really came across like a justification of those accusations. He included personal attacks which, as Ruth pointed out in #1381, had little basis. (i.e., "we kick people out because we feel like it" but at the same time "if you got kicked out you must have deserved it"?!). His personal attacks on her didn't get clipped. HE didn't get told to go to e-mail. He just got told, "That's uncool." [ That because my friend, I erred in allowing people to call #p/g! a bunch of assholes. I owe at least that much to him, it's only fair, as your point is. :rush-mgr ] But when others respond to his post, most of those who didn't get clipped out right (with an accompanying message like "Take this CRAP to e-mail" which I think is just as personally insulting as the rest of it) got Rush-mgr comments between every paragraph. [ Well, then allow me to tell you to "Take *this* CRAP to email" and we'll discuss it then. :rush-mgr ] To my understanding it is right in line to attack the post and not the poster. To say, "Your post was immature and out of line" was, as far as I know, right in line with how things have always been done here. Why do you now rebuke people for doing so? I guess what I'm trying to say to you and to everyone is, I think your treatment of this debate is biased and unjust. I think you're operating on a double standard. Slythex may be your buddy, but he still came across as an utter jerk. People WILL respond to such displays of immaturity. You let them respond in other matters; it's not fair for you to censor them in this one. [ CENSOR! Oh my god! Blah blah blah. I think what you're looking for is in USENET, which is the free for all non-CENSORED forum. Feel free to unsubscribe if you're not happy. :rush-mgr ] It's ESPECIALLY unfair for you to censor opposition as a defense of Slythex, so that only one side of the debate is allowed an unrestricted voice. It's ABOMINABLY unfair to clip out someone's post as being too personal for a public forum, and then replace it with your own personal message made public. I mean, if you want to tell them what crap you think their post was, you can bloody well take it to e-mail yourself, right? I mean, as long as THEY have to. Double standards SUCK. [ Actually I would either delete the CRAP, or include it and then have their flames be public. In both cases it's a catch-22. In my thankless job, imagine all the second guessers out there. "Well, I would have done it this way" "You were wrong to do it like this" "Why did you delete this and not that". And then of course if I take out the posts completely, "Oh hey man! You're an ass! How DARE YOU not include my posting! How dare you CENSOR me! Why you !#@$!#" Of course Niki, if you've never run a moderated list before, I wouldn't expect you to understand. :rush-mgr ] (sorry...I'm getting angry here. Take some deep breaths...) Gawd knows you signed no contract saying you would be unbiased and just, but on the other hand, common decency sometimes requires it. Please, for the sake of open debate and fair play, post this to the digest. Thank you. [ Actually I was going to reply to you in private email but I see you really wanted this in here, so there you have it, along with my replies, since you did address me. :rush-mgr ] --Niki LeBoeuf --------------------------------------------------------- From: Niki Leboeuf Date: Mon, 22 Jul 1996 18:25:22 -0700 (PDT) Subject: NMS environment / Star of Solomon [whole post deleted, but this sig was kinda funny, so...] --The 3-line .sig Vortex vortexae@u.washington.edu: Writer, Rush fan, Kitchen-witch, Pagan, etc... "Quit sittin' on the fence" -somebody RESOLVE Your Conflifts With A "Fence? What fence?" -me Food Processor: NO LUMPS! --------------------------------------------------------- From: Doug White Date: Tue, 23 Jul 96 00:47 EST Subject: Can't we all just get along???? Here's the deal. If you think John whatsname from #p/g! is an asshole and you don't want to go on #p/g!, don't go. If you think John is a great guy and you love talking to him and the rest of the people on #p/g!, do it. I don't care one way or the other. Just, please, PLEASE, can we move on to something else? PRETTY PLEASE???? WITH SUGAR ON TOP???? Top 10 things I'd rather do than read anymore about #p/g! 10. Spend the whole day reading more about gold CDs. 9. Spend the whole day reading more about Rush replacements. 8. Spend the whole day reading more about Neil's letter to MD. 7. Move back in with my parents. 6. Go back in time to 10:30 p.m., April 15. 5. Go back in time to the O.J. trial. 4. Watch the damn Dream Team. 3. Watch damn ballroom dancing. 2. Listen to new Metallica. 1. Three words -- Boutros Boutros Hootie!!!! Doug "Pretty please with sugar on top. Now clean the fucking car." The Wolf [ Number 7 ain't so bad :-) Just think of the fringe benefits! Home cooking and nice dinners, free laundry, and free room! Can't be that bad! :-) :rush-mgr ] --------------------------------------------------------- From: EtanG4raps@aol.com Date: Tue, 23 Jul 1996 02:28:17 -0400 Subject: X-Files [shit deleted] rush mgr - are you friends with the guy from #p/g - "i get this feeling" - he was a little harsh though - IMO [ If you're refering to John, yes. But I'm also good friends with many of the regulars on #p/g! Let's say we've held Rush parties and been to shows and such, the things most Rush fans like to do with their friends. :rush-mgr ] --------------------------------------------------------- From: HerrWitt@aol.com Date: Tue, 23 Jul 1996 01:07:14 -0400 Subject: Bryn Smith & more... Subject 3: Can we refrain from the p/g IRC stuff? If you don't like that channel, don't go there. Nuff said! --------------------------------------------------------- From: "J." Date: Tue, 23 Jul 1996 09:47:28 +0000 Subject: 2cents on #p/g! Let's get one thing straight, John is a jerk, but he doesn't claim to be otherwise. He and the rest of #p/g! do have a certain style about them. I can't say I like or hate them, infact I am rather indifferent to them as a whole. I did the #p/g! thing and when I didn't find value in it anymore, I left. John has a certain flair for pushing people to the edge, I happen to find that appealing. Not because he can be so abrasive, but because it means he has his _own_ ideas, and isn't concerned with what anyone else thinks about them. That sort of individuality is pretty cool. So although I think it is odd to have a Rush channel and not talk about Rush, I dont see why everyone has to act like a bunch of two year olds that have their toy taken away from a bigger kid. It comes down to a very simple premise, "If you don't like #p/g!, don't go there." My hat is off to John and the rest of the people of #p/g!, if not for anything else than being who they are and not giving a damn about anyone else. --------------------------------------------------------- From: Robyn King-Nitschke Date: Tue, 23 Jul 1996 08:48:49 -0700 Subject: hmm... Hmm... If this #p/g! thing isn't about Rush (which it obviously isn't, since from eyewitness reports anybody who even brings up the subject of Rush there gets yelled at/kicked off/insulted, then... uh... why are we wasting this much bandwidth discussing it on the Rush list? -Rat (when did TNMS become the #p/g! Fan Club, anyway?) --------------------------------------------------------- From: Christopher_Muller.WESTINGHOUSE-PGBU@notes.compuserve.com Date: 23 Jul 96 11:48:37 EDT Subject: Flame War In other news, the #p/g! flame war rages on. Sometimes, I wish there was an official Rush page (although that will probably never happen if Neil has anything to do about it). It would be cool if there was an uninvolved party that could halt these personal flame wars and not actually become part of them. Unfortunately, this hasn't happened in this case. I actually feel a little embarrassed for the people involved - people I once held in high regard, but now seem so out of line. Too bad for this list, really. Chris Muller --------------------------------------------------------- From: "Ruth Goodman" Date: 23 Jul 1996 09:35:13 -0700 Subject: Debunchifying Spray I have an extra large, super-strength can of spray reserved for the Rush-mgr. Looks like having people talk (maybe truthfully?) about his friends on p/g! got his panties all bundled up;). Always the loving Rush fan(atic)- Ruth --------------------------------------------------------- From: "Ruth Goodman" Date: 23 Jul 1996 09:49:10 -0700 Subject: You Asked.... In response to my statement that only ass-holes would think that being an ass-hole is funny, Rush-mgr wrote.. >[ So what are you saying Ruth? That I'm an asshole as well as John? Please do reply..... Well, based on your comments in the last few issues, and the way you have treated some of the people here, yes. [ Write me sometime and I'll tell you what I really think of you. The digest I've decided is not appropiate more me to start giving you my real thoughts. :rush-mgr] I'm sorry, but you asked. Of course, you may just decide to omit this and anything else you don't want to hear, like I saw you do a few issues ago. That's not what I sent you $6 for. [ Oh please, if it means that much you to, I'll return you the $6. As if you really wanted to hear "John, you're an asshole neanderthal.." Hmm.. actually, that might please you. :rush-mgr ] Always the loving, but can't help but be honest when asked, Rush fan(atic) Ruth --------------------------------------------------------- From: "Roman E. Fail, (RF)" Date: Tue, 23 Jul 96 11:05:28 PDT Subject: Tired of #p/g war You know, I used to actually enjoy reading the NMS - but since it has become a childish flame war lately with so much name calling I have started to lose interest. Even to rush-mgr has stooped down to participate in it! How long will it take you guys to realize that people are just different? Accept them for who they are. You don't have to like them, but don't try to tell them they have to fit your definition of "nice" or "acceptable." That's just foolish. --------------------------------------------------------- From: mattm@ag.Arizona.EDU (Matt Macari) Date: Tue, 23 Jul 1996 11:15:52 -0700 Subject: opinions, opinions, opinions <[ So what are you saying Ruth? That I'm an asshole as well as John? Please < do reply. That would be asshole@yyz.com for you. Wait, better make that < nms_grand_asshole@yyz.com Personally, your definition of funny may not < be anywhere REMOTELY close to mine, or John, or others on #p/g! And if < your definition of asshole requires you to use your definition of funny, < then I might say, people whose sense of humor are not like mine or John's < might be considered ASSHOLES THEMSELVES. Wouldn't you agree? With love < and more importantly humor, the original ~Rush Fanatic~ :rush-mgr ] Is it possible for ANYBODY to say anything about this John guy without :rush-mgr replying? Are there some deep ties between you two? WOW, maybe you are the same person ....... oh wait, who cares. [ No. We are not the same person. :rush-mgr ] Matt "sick of hearing about John" Macari --------------------------------------------------------- From: Nobody Date: Tue, 23 Jul 1996 11:17:46 -0700 (MST) Subject: Grammar [shit deleted] And how come no one is allowed to flame this John Santore guy? People are allowed to flame everyone else on this list. Hell, some people are fighting about whether Canada or the US is better, and that is allowed to make it through, though there is absolutely no Rush content in that matter. Maybe the rush-mgr IS John Santore. Hmmm... [ Yes, Alissa, I think you've stumbled on something there. John and I are actually twins. :rush-mgr ] --------------------------------------------------------- From: "Ruth Goodman" Date: 23 Jul 1996 13:07:14 -0700 Subject: NMS Bias I just wanted to add my final comment to the Rush-mgr re: this stupid p/g! thing. (Sheesh, agree with one person who says they are rude, and I get in the middle of a whole tizzy!) I think it is incomprehensible that you would allow flambouyant personal attacks to be made toward me by John S to be posted here publicly, but then, because he is your friend, omit responses from people who chose on their own to come to my defense. [ And Ruth, you've of course wash your hands of all the dirt? Remember, these are elitists assholes of the channel you're refering to. I believe you were the first one to post about it? Yes? And the responses omitted and the posts that were deleted are nothing but a bunch of name calling and personal attacks on John and the people in #p/g! :rush-mgr ] If you are deliberately trying to get people to unsubscribe by making it a publication of your own personal preferrences, I don't believe that will work. What you will get instead is a general attitude of discontent as opposed to the joy we have had, and that will be reflected in future posts. I believe you owe me, anyone whose posts you omitted, and the readership of this newsletter an apology. The only person you DON'T owe an apology is your friend John. Obviously you two have had a great time playing his game, but you should be above taking sides given your position and responsibility to the readers of TNMS. If you want to flame personally, why don't you post as a reader, not as the Rush-mgr/CENSOR? [ Take your own advice next time you decide to bash people in public. Had you done that instead or trying to tell the world what a horrid bunch of people are on #p/g! it may not have gotten to this. Apology? Keep dreaming Ruth my dear. If I flame personally, I do so right here, the same place you have had your opportunity to do so. :rush-mgr ] Always the loving Rush fan(atic) -Ruth --------------------------------------------------------- From: rogrady@sims.net (Roy O'Grady) Date: Tue, 23 Jul 1996 19:43:07 -0500 Subject: An irc comment IMO, it does not matter what you think of the people on p/g or the way the channel operates. Let them be the way they are. If one of them wishes to call himself the ex-laxed asshole of irc and flame Ruth, so be it. It does more to confirm people's bad impresson of the channel than anything else. It may also have the (most likely desired) effect of keeping their playground free of people like us. What I can tell you firsthand is that #yyz is a fun place to go. New people are welcome, and we talk a lot of Rush. If this sounds like what you are interested in, by all means, check it out. If I am there, I am RoyO. We are usually all op-ed (dangerous - I accidently made the channel secret once: our beloved Rush Mgr undid my screw-up), and it is likely that you will be, too. So come on in, pull out a Snapple and sit a spell. [ For the record, yes, I hang out on both channels and they *both* have their positives and negatives. :rush-mgr ] --------------------------------------------------------- From: mrfranklin@ccgate.hac.com Date: Wed, 24 Jul 96 13:05:40 PST Subject: Natural Science etc. [shit deleted] 3rd... To the GHA of TNMS (self-named). Your very original response to my post was oh so clever! I'm just wondering why your feathers are so ruffled? Seriously, based on the year I've been here, you've been pretty even-keeled. What's up? I would hate for a misunderstanding or miscommunication (if that's what it was) to sour this somewhat unique and untraditional relationship. [ Sorry, if they got ruffled, it's because I'm not keen to people bashing my friends and slapping a label on people of that channel. My apologies if you don't like my presentation, it's a matter of speaking up for myself and the people I hang out with. :rush-mgr ] --------------------------------------------------------- From: Balsley-MC{Mark-AAC814}_at_HDM-AAC-01@harte-hanks.com Date: Wed, 24 Jul 96 08:28:27 CST Subject: URghhh! [shit deleted] 2nd - I think some people around here need to get laid, or the new album release date be moved up! I can't believe the attempted flames to John Santore(thanks for deleting them rush-mgr) for "defending" his channel. It kinda reminds me of the Maplethorpe(sp) exhibit here in Cinti back in the 80s where everyone on the extreme right wanted to stop it from showing. There is a plain and simple way to deal with this. DON'T GO TO THE CHANNEL!!! That way you don't bother them and they don't bother you!! Not saying that I agree with everything John Santore had to say, but I don't go there, therefore it doesn't bother me. Now, granted I'm new compared to some of the subscribers on this list, but I kinda thought everyone would be more open minded about everything that has to deal with Rush. I mean come on people, Rush are human just like the rest of us. They are intitled to their opinions even if it doesn't agree with ours. Same goes for everyone else on the mailing list. Let them defend their opinions, reply to it if you feel moved to, but don't get nasty. They don't deserve it. Anyway, that's my 2 cents. --------------------------------------------------------- From: Julie Date: Wed, 24 Jul 1996 21:08:50 -0700 (PDT) Subject: self-appointed mediator I used to hang out on #p/g! too. I've since switched to #wicca, mostly because no one was *on* #p/g! when I came on. Ok, the bot was. But that's no fun. But anyway, I would agree Slythex probably did the Grand High Asshole thing for reaction, because as I remember the bigwig (usually the controller of the bot) was called The Shit. :^) I have no idea how the channel may have changed, and while I think John still considers me a twit for pretending to be drunk on Zima when it was really just Sprite, I will still not complain about him. We had a good time making fun of Ged over the phone before we met. While I guess I don't know him all that well, I can say that yes he's a serious wiseass so don't get your panties in a bind. Not to get personal on Ruth either, using that line. I think she's cool and I'd bet that *someone* on the channel did something shitty to get her to make the first post. But mostly I have to agree with Niki. I know her best. Last time I actually stayed on #p/g! it was just as she described. I do remember a lot of kicking, and yes, sometimes people would be blocked off after being kicked, but it wasn't usually permanent (was it?). Kicking people for mentioning Rush, on the other hand... If you guys on the channel are doing that, I think you need to rename the channel. BTW I wouldn't call John's post a "defense"... I don't think he's ever bothered to "defend" anything. Either you agree or you don't he doesn't care. But I could be wrong. Juno [ Julie, let's not forget about your own personal induction into the #p/g! Hall of Fame either. Oh what was that? 3-4 years ago? Now you've met a lot of people on that channel (myself included) and we all got along okay I think. Let's not go into your adventures on there :) :rush-mgr ] --------------------------------------------------------- From: smjones@students.wisc.edu (Sean Jones) Date: Thu, 25 Jul 1996 00:57:40 -0500 A few not-so-random thoughts. [shit deleted] 2) Stop with the Grand High Asshole stuff, ok? I don't care if he's an asshole or not. I don't care if YOU are an asshole or not. People will make up their own minds basedf on his post whether or not to visit p/g! or whatever the hell it is. Stop it. It is not productive to just flame away at a guy who doesn't care, and it wastes space. --------------------------------------------------------- From: Cliff & Pam Wheaton Date: Thu, 25 Jul 1996 03:35:29 -0600 Subject: comments! [shit deleted] IRC- it's fun to talk around the world with friends. I've never (as I've said before ) been on #p/g! when theres people there-I work too late for most anyone else to be up & there. maybe I'll try during the day next time. I enjoy #yyz & #2112 tho.I've had nothing but great responses & friendlyness there!!The internet has sure made this a small world!! But it sure is nice to know all of you if only through this digest!! Keep rockin' Pam --------------------------------------------------------- From: "Paul W. Cashman" Date: Thu, 25 Jul 1996 04:55:50 -0700 (PDT) Subject: CM, fans, #p/g! Couple of quick notes.... [shit deleted] [THE BETRAYAL] I was a regular on #p/g! for a couple of years before I sadly left. Partly due to the continuing problems on EFNet with netsplits and lag, partly due to evolving tastes in music, and partly due to the loss of comradeship and goodwill that used to permeate the channel. It's hard to describe, but things......changed. Some people who had been really cool became less cool. I heard that rush-mgr, Jimmy himself, had been banned from the channel. Then I was removed from the auto-op list (a signal honor at best, but still....) So, I headed for friendlier pastures and found one, specifically the Dream Theater dedicated server (irc.dreamt.org port 2112). *shrug* I miss the old gang, but things just got too silly, and as I said, some regulars who had been cool had changed. A shame, really. For over a year $p/g! was my IRC home, like a favorite tavern. Ta'veren? Nevermind. :) [ I probably deserved it. Banned because I always idled and hogged the OP on that channel when I did. Besides, it was only temporary. :rush-mgr ] I'll check out the other alternate channels some time. I don't mind talking about Rush -- or not talking about Rush. So long as the floor show is interesting and the cover is free, who can complain? :) --------------------------------------------------------- From: Tony Dormio Date: Thu, 25 Jul 96 07:13 EST Subject: Well ya know Mean Gene... Personally, I wouldn't mind seeing a steal cage match between Ruth and John on the next WWF In you're House pay per view. CX-1 would make a perfect pro wrestling ref, for that matter. --------------------------------------------------------- From: leors@ele.puc-rio.br (Leonardo Rocha Souza) Date: Thu, 25 Jul 96 11:31:22 EST Subject: PARODY !!! First of all, I'm not putting here my personal opinions, but a general vision over this #p/g stuff. #P/G Project Imagine a time when it all began In The National Midnight Star A discussion - that would go so far Whoever found it worth - the meaning of asshole first Would be flamed before Imagine a man where it all began An asshole starting a war (repeating : not my personal opinion) In each posting - people eager to blame more To tell the way they treat To complain the humour is sick GO TO OTHER SHORE !!! Try beeing - graceful in the net Under pressure of Satans The flame war began - they'd cut down everyone Wheter any reaction was done The big boss - try explain the lack Of fairness of that way The asshole intend it would be a mend (again : not my personal opinion) No matter the words we would say Imagine a place where it all began The channel of I. R. C. land They wouldn't talk about - stuff of The Band And the asshole boys (no need to remind you again) Would treat us like their toys Less than they think they are Imagine a man lighted as he can Blowing this stuff away Getting out of war flame on that July day All the peace that be - Could so be brought to we (learned this with Entre Nou\ s) No parodies, please, anymore I'd like to explain (again) that I don't think anyone here is an asshole, since I know very little of most of you. The asshole thing was a self- proclamation (not in a serious way) that I made use. This is dated, but hope it's funny too. light Leonardo. --------------------------------------------------------- From: BINETWORK!B5PO2!strode@biattgw.attmail.com (Strode, Cory) Date: Thu, 25 Jul 1996 10:10:00 +0000 Subject: 2112 the comic On another note, I would like to point out that people are saying that the rush-mgr is Censoring discussion. Not so. Censoring is when an outside force (government usually) imposes rules on a public means of expression. In this forum we are told rules, and we are told that if we don't abide by those rules, our post will not be listed. We know that upfront, and if we want to say something outside those rules, we can e-mail it, or take it to another forum. To give an example, if you were to submit an article filled with profanity to "Highlights for Children," they would not print it, and that would NOT be censorship. However, if you submitted an article to TIME Magazine, and a government official told TIME they could not run it, that would be censorship. --------------------------------------------------------- From: abosco@dataviz.com (Adrianne Bosco) Date: Thu, 25 Jul 1996 12:57:20 +0000 Subject: 2112 Graphic Novel If we can't get along, then can we at least make a special digest for discussing IRC like we did when all that Neil MD stuff was going on? Better yet, like everyone is saying.. can you take it to email? This is one of them threads from hell... --------------------------------------------------------- From: Matt Falter Date: Thu, 25 Jul 1996 16:31:14 -0500 (CDT) Subject: Hearing Rush at a local bar [shit deleted] I usually don't send much in to the NMS because I'm quite contented with reading everybody's opinions and questions. Just thought I would mention that all the arguing about people getting their posts cut or flaming someone is actually pretty damn funny at times. We are all subscribed to this list because we like Rush, but that doesn't mean we all have to agree with everything everybody says or writes, but I think that a lot of the people on this list need to relax a little and just appreciate the fact that we have this list for our opinions/questions/wishes/etc... Thanks to the rush managers for maintaining this list. It usually keeps me busy when I got some programs running. --------------------------------------------------------- I think this is it ============================================================================= John Santore "I could not love thee, so much, jsbh@andrew.cmu.edu loved I not honor more" jsbh@securities.com -Richard Lovelace http://www.securities.com:8000/~jsbh/home.html Go Flyers! Go Sabres! =============================================================================